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Thread: FMIC gains?

              
  1. #76
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by uae escort Click here to enlarge
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    I have to show you some thank you to you for bailing me from this type of instance. Just after surfing the net and make suggestions that were not powerful, I assumed my entire life was well over. Being alive devoid of the solutions to the difficulties you have fixed through the article is a critical case, and those which could have in a negative way damaged my entire career if I had not encountered your website. Your ability and kindness in taking care of all things was important. I do not know what I would have done if I had not discovered a subject like this. I can also now look forward to my future. Thank you for your time very much for this professional and sensible help. I will not hesitate to propose the blog to anyone who will need assistance on this subject. respect
    Creepy translation with respect to the username.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
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    Gain will be the same but not the power? Um, ok.

    Yes, ambient temp always is a facotr.

    A couple passes is definitely enough to heak soak an N54. Take one to a strip, anyone who has knows this. Do back to back passes in hot weather and talk to me.

    I can heat soak an N54 with one pass. Seriously. Especially if I'm sitting in the staging lanes waiting.
    Yes the gain - difference in power - will be approximately the same. I can't comment as to other intercooler/hardware, but I have not experience that heat soak with my intercooler and it would appear the OP has not either.

  3. #78
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rudypoochris Click here to enlarge
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    Yes the gain - difference in power - will be approximately the same. I can't comment as to other intercooler/hardware, but I have not experience that heat soak with my intercooler and it would appear the OP has not either.
    Yea like i said for me, i consistently have more power, whether it ranges between 10-20whp/tq with the weather i dont know. Also, i ran 3 quarter mile passes without stopping or turning the car off and sitting in the staging lanes, within 12 minutes and did not experience any sign of heatsoak, traps, ETs and launches were almost identical in these three runs lol

    edit: it wasnt hot out though, it was in the 60s ill do a weekend daytime track day when i get home, im sure it will be in the 80s even this time of year in south florida Click here to enlarge
    - Proven Power Tampa built 6466 ST -
    - N54 6AT WR 711whp 637wtq-
    -N54 WR 1/4mile trap: 133.57mph- -

  4. #79
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    I'll try my take on this after reading it. An IC's main goal would be to keep air temps cool enough that the DME does not pull timing. The minimal gains from temperature changes would depend on the level and type of tune you are running. This is why it's a supporting mod because your should not be running a tune that your IC cannot support. Does squirting water(leaving Meth out of it) into your intake add power, not really but it cools it to where you can reliably run more timing without overheating the charge and having the DME pull timing back again. Given that this is a cooling mod similar to any other heat exchange on the car radiator, oil cooler or trans cooler that is a common mod on plenty of other cars in history you wouldn't expect to hear a radiator added power would you? But if the ECU/ECM of that other car pulled timing when the coolant temp got over a certain degree after a run down the track it would be considered a supporting mod that would allow your engine and DME configuration to run to it's full potential.

  5. #80
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by brusk Click here to enlarge
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    I'll try my take on this after reading it. An IC's main goal would be to keep air temps cool enough that the DME does not pull timing. The minimal gains from temperature changes would depend on the level and type of tune you are running. This is why it's a supporting mod because your should not be running a tune that your IC cannot support. Does squirting water(leaving Meth out of it) into your intake add power, not really but it cools it to where you can reliably run more timing without overheating the charge and having the DME pull timing back again. Given that this is a cooling mod similar to any other heat exchange on the car radiator, oil cooler or trans cooler that is a common mod on plenty of other cars in history you wouldn't expect to hear a radiator added power would you? But if the ECU/ECM of that other car pulled timing when the coolant temp got over a certain degree after a run down the track it would be considered a supporting mod that would allow your engine and DME configuration to run to it's full potential.
    Straightforward, simple.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by brusk Click here to enlarge
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    I'll try my take on this after reading it. An IC's main goal would be to keep air temps cool enough that the DME does not pull timing. The minimal gains from temperature changes would depend on the level and type of tune you are running. This is why it's a supporting mod because your should not be running a tune that your IC cannot support. Does squirting water(leaving Meth out of it) into your intake add power, not really but it cools it to where you can reliably run more timing without overheating the charge and having the DME pull timing back again. Given that this is a cooling mod similar to any other heat exchange on the car radiator, oil cooler or trans cooler that is a common mod on plenty of other cars in history you wouldn't expect to hear a radiator added power would you? But if the ECU/ECM of that other car pulled timing when the coolant temp got over a certain degree after a run down the track it would be considered a supporting mod that would allow your engine and DME configuration to run to it's full potential.
    I don't agree that the ICs main goal is to avoid pulling timing. Maybe you use it differently than I do but I use it to get a denser air charge. I use higher octane to avoid losing timing (E85).

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    Are you aware that our ECU pulls significant timing as the air charge heats up even if there's no knock? That's a big part of why meth is so effective for us.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Carl Morris Click here to enlarge
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    Are you aware that our ECU pulls significant timing as the air charge heats up even if there's no knock? That's a big part of why meth is so effective for us.
    I haven't seen that on JB4 logs I have run? Do I need to look elsewhere? I run E85 mixes only and have max timing with 0 avg ign all the time.

    Regardless, if you always operate in a region where timing is pulled, adding timing is akin to adding power.

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    I don't know what a JB4 can show you, but it's clear on a Cobb. It starts pulling time at air charge temps between 43-45C (~110F). Unless the JB4 actually sends a false temperature signal and then compensates the fuel some other way (which I doubt), this affects you the same as everyone else. And you can't just add more timing because it will knock, which is the reason they pull timing in the first place. With E85 mixes that situation improves and you can add some timing back in without knock, but the system might not be smart enough to do that just enough to compensate for what the ECU is pulling.

    So anyway, the reason an IC (or meth) makes more power than you'd think is because we get the improved charge density AND the better timing. I'm not a fan of meth but I can see why some people are, since you can always get your air charge below 110F using meth, where you can't always achieve that with just an IC in hot weather.

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    I agree that in cases where you are octane limited it can add timing. That is only another benefit to added power. For me personally it has done nothing for timing since I have been running E85 long since I got an FMIC. Adding timing or lowering temperature both result in more power. I don't see how it can be argued not to be a power adder.

    Maybe it is anti power sub tractor???? (if you do the math....)

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rudypoochris Click here to enlarge
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    I agree that in cases where you are octane limited it can add timing. That is only another benefit to added power. For me personally it has done nothing for timing since I have been running E85 long since I got an FMIC. Adding timing or lowering temperature both result in more power. I don't see how it can be argued not to be a power adder.
    Nobody is saying it can't add power.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
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    Nobody is saying it can't add power.
    You said it isn't a power mod. It is. Thats what all of this has been about... lol.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rudypoochris Click here to enlarge
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    You said it isn't a power mod. It is. Thats what all of this has been about... lol.
    That's because I said it was a cooling and consistency mod that supports power mods. At no point did I say it can not add power. I think my point has been very consistent not sure why you are misunderstanding it now.

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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Sticky Click here to enlarge
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    That's because I said it was a cooling and consistency mod that supports power mods. At no point did I say it can not add power. I think my point has been very consistent not sure why you are misunderstanding it now.
    Semantics. Its a mod that adds power but it isn't a power mod. I am not misunderstanding. By that same token DPs are an exhaust mod and the tune is a software mod. They just happen to add power too.

  15. #90
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    Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by rudypoochris Click here to enlarge
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    Semantics. Its a mod that adds power but it isn't a power mod. I am not misunderstanding. By that same token DPs are an exhaust mod and the tune is a software mod. They just happen to add power too.
    No not by that same token because that's not what I'm saying. A tune is both software and a power mode just like DP's are both an exhaust and power mod. You can describe them accurately with either.

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    Don't forget the (admittedly small) flow characteristic benefits of a better IC. Less pressure drop/etc.

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